Continuing from last time's Facebook conversation:
Me:
AL,
thanks for your thoughts.
Yes, I don't know what to say about rape other than that it is a hateful, horrible act and the criminal should be punished.
NOTE THAT THIS MEANS THAT THE *CRIMINAL* SHOULD BE PUNISHED, NOT THE INNOCENT. That means we don't kill the baby, who had no part in the rape, for the crimes of his father.
Yes, there are many things men can do to remedy the prevalence of rape. No, men have not done even close to what we should do in that regard. Yes, men are quite guilty, and God will not hold us guiltless. In fact, these crimes are so bad that they have brought a horrible death upon God's beloved son, Jesus, such that rapists can be saved by the grace of Jesus and if not, rapists will suffer torment for eternity, separated from God. So it's deadly serious, just like all sin is. Molly and BK, unfortunately, have shown little evidence of having considered the implications of the fact that we all are sinners. Does that mean we skate by in life and hope that God will forgive at the end? I tell you that Jesus has already spoken clearly about that - He will NOT forgive unless the sinner has repented of ALL of his sin and thrown himself 100% on the mercy of God, because of the Cross of Jesus. "I tell you the truth, unless you believe that I Am He, you will die in your sins" - John 8:24.
Your distinction between abortion and medically-necessary procedure is a good one. Let me remind you that this situation represents around 1% or less of all abortions, so this does not constitute a valid defense of the vast majority of abortions.
If the woman is certain of dying as well as the baby, it would be justifiable to surgically do what is necessary to save one life rather than lose both. This is not abortion. Motivation does matter.
The analogy you attempt to make about men and vasectomies is invalid, however. Accidental pregnancies happen all the time; you say men should be sterilised b/c of them. I say this would be subject to all sorts of abuses. Who is to judge whether the woman really did want the pregnancy or whether she is using the situation to get back at the man? Who will judge the hearts in that case?
Also, if I advocate that abortion be illegal, that means nothing more than that babies are humans and murdering humans is illegal. The woman has the choice to reproduce just as the man does - have sex or don't. If the woman is raped, that's quite another matter, and I wouldn't mind, say, a punishment of castration as well as incarceration for a rapist. But that is also ~1% of abortions in the USA.
The woman, if "forced" to bear the child to term (ie, compelled by the law not to murder the child), she still has all the reproductive choice she had before - sex or no sex, and thus child or no child. Go around sterilising men for accidental pregnancies, and you've done something totally different.
What I'd much prefer to see, and what would be more consistently applicable to both the mother and the father, is much more emphasis on the man providing child support. If you father a child, you pay for him and for his needs. If you don't want to do that, don't go around having sex. If you do it, that's the consequence. No excuses, no court loopholes.
Me: --"You wont answer about your family becasue deep down, in a place where you think you are better, you would probably do the same thing."
You know virtually nothing about me, JT.
But in addition to what I've already said and in light of your failure to answer it, let me also say this - if my wife were raped, it is by the grace of Jesus in giving me a new heart that I would not murder the child for the sins of his father.
Before I knew Jesus, the life of a baby had no importance to me. I didn't care about anyone really, except what I could gain from them. But since Jesus has transformed me into a new creature, I love children and refuse to punish them for what they are innocent of, just for the sake of my convenience.
Please answer my questions, JT. If you don't know to which ones I refer, go back and read all my comments here. Every time you see a "?" at the end of a sentence, answer it.
JT: Rhology, I would be afraid to insult AL like you did the others. Nice way to be nice about it and give your opinion.
Me: And no, I most certainly do not believe I am better. I am simply forgiven, and by God's grace I trust Him wholly, rather than trusting my own vain speculations as I see y'all doing. I pray you will repent.
http://www.abolishhumanabortion.com/2011/04/we-are-not-better.html
JT: Who says I havent repented?
Me: JT,
Accuse me all you want of "insults". I'm going to stick to the issues and not discuss myself, as if this is somehow all about me.
Me: That's a question only you can answer, in the light of the BIble. But since you think the Bible is full of untruth, I have no idea how you could even know what repentance means, what it is, how one does it, and what difference it makes.
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